Slack founder: Mental models for building products people love ft. Stewart Butterfield
Descripción del Episodio
Stewart Butterfield is the co-founder of Slack and Flickr, two of the most influential products in internet history. After selling Slack to Salesforce in one of tech’s biggest acquisitions, he’s been focused on family, philanthropy, and creative projects. In this rare podcast appearance, Stewart shares the product frameworks and leadership principles that most contributed to his success. From “utility curves” to “the owner’s delusion” to “hyper-realistic work-like activities,” his thoughts on craft, strategy, and leadership apply to anyone building products or leading teams.
We discuss:
1. Hyper-realistic work-like activities
2. The owner’s delusion
3. Utility curves
4. “Don’t make me think”
5. “We don’t sell saddles here”
6. Tilting your umbrella
7. When to pivot
—
Brought to you by:
WorkOS—Modern identity platform for B2B SaaS, free up to 1 million MAUs
Metronome—Monetization infrastructure for modern software companies
Lovable—Build apps by simply chatting with AI
—
Transcript: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/slack-founder-stewart-butterfield
—
My biggest takeaways (for paid newsletter subscribers): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/i/178320649/my-biggest-takeaways-from-this-conversation
—
Where to find Stewart Butterfield:
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/butterfield
—
Where to find Lenny:
• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com
• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/
—
In this episode, we cover:
(00:00) Introduction to Stewart Butterfield
(04:58) Stewart’s current life and reflections
(06:44) Understanding utility curves
(10:13) The concept of divine discontent
(15:11) The importance of taste in product design
(19:03) Tilting your umbrella
(28:32) Balancing friction and comprehension
(45:07) The value of constant dissatisfaction
(47:06) Embracing continuous improvement
(50:03) The complexity of making things work
(54:27) Parkinson’s law and organizational growth
(01:03:17) Hyper-realistic work-like activities
(01:13:23) Advice on when to pivot
(01:18:36) The importance of generosity in leadership
(01:26:34) The owner’s delusion
—
Referenced:
• Slack: https://slack.com
• Flickr: https://www.flickr.com
• Cal Henderson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/iamcal
• Blok: https://blok.so
• Brandon Velestuk on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandon-velestuk-6018721b
• Magic Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Link
• Ticketmaster: https://www.ticketmaster.com
• John Collison on X: https://x.com/collision
• Patrick Collison on X: https://x.com/patrickc
• Sundar Pichai on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sundarpichai
• Three Questions with Slack’s CEO: https://www.technologyreview.com/2014/11/21/170330/three-questions-with-slacks-ceo
• Six Sigma: https://www.6sigma.us
• What is kaizen and how does Toyota use it?: https://mag.toyota.co.uk/kaizen-toyota-production-system
• John Collison’s post on X about passion projects: https://x.com/collision/status/1529452415346302976
• Parkinson’s law: https://www.economist.com/news/1955/11/19/parkinsons-law
• We Don’t Sell Saddles Here: https://medium.com/@stewart/we-dont-sell-saddles-here-4c59524d650d
• Glitch: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glitch_(video_game)
• IRC: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC
• This will make you a better decision-maker | Annie Duke (author of “Thinking in Bets” and “Quit,” former pro poker player): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/making-better-decisions-annie-duke
• The woman behind Canva shares how she built a $42B company from nothing | Melanie Perkins: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-making-of-canva
• Prisoner’s dilemma: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner%27s_dilemma
• Stewart Little: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Little
• Dharma and Greg: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dharma_%26_Greg
• Stewart’s post on X referencing “the owner’s delusion”: https://x.com/stewart/status/1223286626991796224
—
Recommended books:
• Principles: Life and Work: https://www.amazon.com/Principles-Life-Work-Ray-Dalio/dp/1501124021
• Why Nothing Works: Who Killed Progress―and How to Bring It Back: https://www.amazon.com/Why-Nothing-Works-Killed-Progress_and/dp/154170021X
• Positioning: The Battle for Your Mind: https://www.amazon.com/Positioning-Battle-Your-Al-Ries/dp/0071373586
• Quit: The Power of Knowing When to Walk Away: https://www.amazon.com/Quit-Power-Knowing-When-Walk/dp/0593422996
—
Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email [email protected].
—
Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.
To hear more, visit www.lennysnewsletter.com
Episodios Recientes
Más podcasts de Sociedad y Cultura
Ver toda la categoría →
Finect Talks
By shows
<a href="https://go.ivoox.com/wv/premios26?c=6406" target="_blank">¡Vótame en los Premios iVoox 2026!</a> <br>Finect Talks, el podcast que te ayuda a invertir mejor. Hablamos de ahorro e inversión de una forma entretenida y con un invitado semanal. https://www.finect.com/
La Burrera
By shows
Cuando parece que varios amigos alcanzan un punto de risa de no retorno, siempre hay un punto más allá. Pere Aznar, Ana Morgade e Iggy Rubín, junto a un invitado, competirán por ver quién dice \u0022la más gorda\u0022 sobre un tema.
AM
By shows
El resumen informativo de The Voice Village, dirigido por Conchi Gil, producido por Ricardo Villa y narrado por Conchi Gil y Dani Gutierrez. Una producción de The Voice Village. De lunes a viernes, a las 7:30 AM. @amelpodcast
Estas Rica
By shows
Estás Rica Podcast es el close friends más hot de Dani Sayan: artista intensa, graduada de psicología y cero paciencia para el autoengaño. Aquí se habla de deseo, apego, ambición, poder personal y caos emocional… con humor picante, verdades incómodas y vibes de “sí soy sensible, pero también peligrosa”. Vienes a sentirte vista, removida y un poquito atacada. Sales más clara, más rica y con menos ganas de conformarte. Dedicado a mujeres, hombres, personas no binaries, y cualquier ser que quiera mejorar en todo aspecto. Y cuando el universo deja de ser místico y se convierte en programas, la transformación se hace práctica: si quieres ir más profundo, los programas viven en estasrica.com.
Not Just A Terrible Story
By shows
When Stacie Love married her former high school teacher, she thought it was a whirlwind romance. Two decades later, she discovered the truth behind the day their lives unraveled: a federal search, an unseen investigation, and a story far darker than she ever knew. Not Just A Terrible Story is a six-part investigation into one woman’s search for the truth, the scourge of alleged educator sexual misconduct, and a culture of complicity that protected predators for decades.
Giggly Squad
By shows
Welcome to Giggly Squad. Each week, Hannah Berner and Paige DeSorbo make fun of everything, but most importantly themselves. They discuss pop culture, fashion trends, television, horoscopes, mental health, dating, and expose their personal lives. Also, they can't be managed. Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of Giggly Squad ad-free. Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus.
老婆等我之火影重生|火影同人|多人有声剧|多播
By shows
<p style="color:#333333;font-weight:normal;font-size:16px;line-height:30px;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;hyphens:auto;text-align:justify;">“表哥！”佐助回头大叫一声，然而，背后突然出现了一幅惊心动魄的画面：一群从来没有见过的怪兽咆哮着向他冲来，怪售长着一副闪亮的铠甲，扁平的身体上方有一个凸起，凸起中伸出一根长长的管子，与其说怪兽，不如说是一群钢铁机器！只见那群钢铁机器长长、的管子里火光一闪，一颗颗尖头的金属就被抛射出来，在佐助周围炸开，周围一片火海滔滔，瞬间毁灭了周围的建筑和街道！佐助心里紧张万分，只剩下一个念头，那就是逃！赶快逃！以最快的速度逃走！他不想死在这里！虽然身上现在加上自己的负重铁块总共有约三倍的重力，但是，他心底的潜力被极度激发，完全忽视了中立的影响。</p><br /><p style="color:#333333;font-weight:normal;font-size:16px;line-height:30px;font-family:Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;hyphens:auto;text-align:justify;"> 我站在一棵大树上，看到佐助在空无一人的街道上发狂奔跑，好几次快要跑不动了，却又重新激发了潜能，一次次突破了身体的障碍，最后竟然跑起来就不停了！我笑着一挥手，佐助立即喘着气瘫倒在地上。</p><br /><span><br /></span><span><br /></span><br />
Materia Oscura
By shows
Materia Oscura es un programa especializado en Ciencia del periodista José Manuel Nieves. Universo, física, hallazgos, nuevas investigaciones... Todo pasa por el tamiz de Nieves.